TSM Forum: Tim & Sid

TSM Forum: Tim & Sid

 

 

by mike in boston / @mikeinbostonemail

 

Good morning sports media watchers. With the holidays upon us I thought I would mix things up a little. Some of you will have no time for internet things while others will have lots. As such, I am going to post a topic that could be a topic of discussion over the next couple of weeks until real sports media news cranks up again. If this works out well then we can do more of this kind of thing in the future. Stay safe on the roads and for the love of all this holy put snow tires on your car.

 

Forum: Tim & Sid

 

I miss Tim & Sid's Score podcast. Perhaps this is rose-coloured reminiscing. However I thought it provided a fresh and independent voice for hardcore sports fans. It was clearly something the two of them put work into.

 

The first year at the FAN was pretty good. After that it became apparent to my ears that having to do 3 hours a day while also promoting the work of other Sportsnet personalities diluted the quality of the product. Then Sid went viral and Tim settled into his current role of setting up their bits and providing the laugh track while his partner does his thing. That's when I stopped listening and writing about them here.

 

screen-shot-2016-12-17-at-8-43-50-am

 

This would sign their ticket back to TV and make them some of the best paid sports personalities in the country. As we have discussed at length here, the timing of this move was sub-optimal since it put them in direct competition with last decade's most powerful Sportsnet personality Bob McCown. That was, however, necessitated by the Don Kollins decision to bring in Dean Blundell to do mornings, which displaced the successful Brady & Walker show.

 

With the growing possibility that Dean might be taking his talents elsewhere I'd like to raise the question:

 

Would Sportsnet ever move Tim & Sid back to radio to take over mornings?

 

Let's leave aside the question of whether Tim & Sid would agree to it for the sake of argument. The main reason against this move would be that TV is where the money is (at least that's the conventional wisdom from the time before the internet) and radio is a pittance by comparison.

 

Here's why I find this argument unconvincing: ESPN has a hugely successful syndicated radio show in "Mike & Mike" that they also show on television. Awful Announcing has a story collecting info from various published sources stating that Mike Greenberg is one of the highest paid people at ESPN and that his contract includes provisions for various roles at the network. 

 

This is a model Sportsnet could use with Tim&Sid. I would argue they are getting poor value for their investment currently. I am almost never home from 5-7 and if I am I am not watching TV. To be fair, I understand they have spent more time trying to be a place where serious sports talk happens.

 

This might explain their new branding, to which a reader recently drew my attention:

 

timsid

 

Now, it's not clear to me whether this is sincere or intended as a joke. In light of the content they feature on the show's website, I'm leaning towards the latter:

 

timsid2

 

With the news this week that Rogers is abandoning their IPTV plans and taking a half billion dollar write-down as a result it seems reasonable to think the company might be looking to create efficiencies elsewhere to prevent analysts and investors from souring on the stock. We saw the same pressure following the disappointing hockey ratings. Further, Sportsnet Mag delivered its final issue this month as Rogers looks to reduce its presence in the unprofitable world of print magazines. This will add a lot of people to Sportsnet's already stuffed roster of writers and editors at the website. 

 

In light of all of this it might be the time to revisit the sports media division and see where personalities are miscast or could be used more "synergistically" (I have been reading too many press releases). Tim&Sid jumps out to me as a prime candidate in that discussion.

 

Over to you:

 

1) Do you still find Tim&Sid credible sports voices or have they become something else since their move to TV?

 

2) Would you listen to them on your morning commute?

 

3) Do you tune in to watch their TV show or would you be just as happy with Jackie Redmond's clip show on repeat?

 

—–

 

thanks for reading and commenting,

until next time …

mike (not really in boston)

 

COMMENTS

WORDPRESS: 60
  • comment-avatar
    Adam R 3 months

    I was a huge fan of Tim and Sid. Despite the horrible continued use of the match game they were a delight to listen to. Since they moved to TV I don't watch them or follow them. I just can't find the time. Plus I would much rather watch or listen to PTS.

    I would love it if they returned to radio in the morning or back in their 1-4 timeslot.

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    Chris 3 months

    I’ve always found Tim and Sid to be annoying and pretty dumb when it comes to sports. Sid is a troll who has declared the Jays season dead multiple times over the past two years. He’s not funny and is smug, how people find him entertaining is beyond me.

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    Steph 3 months

    I think Tim and Sid are great, especially considering the current level of sport talk on offer. It’s unlistenable and they are at least fresh and entertaining.

    I never watch their TV show, my 9-5 job and commute schedule doesn’t allow it.

    If they had a morning show, it might just bring me back to the Fan. Might.

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    mario 3 months

    Thanks for the read: I do currently enjoy Tim & Sid and PVR them to watch later, and watch PTS live. This at least  this gives me the option to fast forward some of their childish humour , but they do have some great guests at times other than the usual Rogers stable of talent. Not sure how it would fair on radio  in the morning seeing the limited amount of A class guests in that time slot which all morning shows fall into the same problem. They do  talk on  a  variety of sports and sound well versed  in doing so as well.

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    Drumanchor 3 months

    Very nice post and an interesting point of discussion.

    At the risk of stating an overused cliche, it seems that either you love T&S or you don't. There appears to be very little middle ground. I tend to be like you, MIB. Initiallly I enjoyed their radio show on The Fan, but eventually soured on it. What was once rather fresh, became predicable, contrived and juvenile. Couple that with Sid incessantly reminding listeners what they were listening to, where they were listening to it and where they could watch it, I gave up and switched to TSN 1050 (where I still am, except for PTS).

    Could their act work for morning drive? Seems to me that people have been suggesting that for years. Since Rogers appears to be all in with their sctick, and if their numbers will not be missed on the TV side, why not give it a try?

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    Curt 3 months

    The quality of their show reminds me of a high school multi-media project that my son might do with a buddy. I'm not talking about the set or overall production, but rather the two guys in front of the camera trying desperately to be funny.

    No, I don't watch it. I outgrew poo poo and pee pee jokes a long time ago.

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    Darrell 3 months

    I loved them on the 1-4 pm time slot, especially this time of year hustling and bustling for Christmas gifts. A lot about the FAN programming I do not like right now, but moving them to the 5:30 AM to 9 AM slot would be a welcome change vs, the current morning show crew.

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    cirroc 3 months

    Couldn't have said it better myself.  His rants are embarrassing and self serving.  His smugness is off the charts and I get the feeling he thinks he's a pretty big deal.  

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    GreyCountyMike 3 months

    Understanding they have worked together for a while, is it a given that Tim & Sid are a package deal forever at Rogers/FAN?

    Micallef is a good broadcaster who studies his craft and its content; his work on Canadian university football is very solid. Pull away odd antic … and what you see and hear is a hard-working professional.

    Seixeiro, on the other hand, well… As has been suggested already, it's difficult for someone who apparently is perfect and knows it all to possibly get any better.

     

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    Daniel 3 months

    I think Tim and Sid were a huge breath of fresh air when they came to The Fan.  Sports radio here has such an excess of sort of square, old fashioned types, who relate everything to hockey. Even though there was some stuff I didn't like (Sid's rants are so hacky sports radio), Tim and Sid are at least different, and fun.

    Maybe it's been better for their salaries, but I've barely watched Tim and Sid since they moved to TV. It's an inconvenient time, and when I have watched they don't seem to have the same loose fun they could have on radio.

    I'd love it if they went back to radio.  The Fan took a big step back when they lost Tim/Sid and added Blundell in my opinion.  One idea – if Tim and Sid don't want to give up TV, what if they did both?  A number of ESPN personalities do a TV show and do radio.  Make the Tim/Sid TV show half an hour (could start it at 6 – seriously who's watching at 5pm), and then give the guys a 1 or 2 hour radio show as well.  With the Hockey Central @ noon ratings down, how about they replace that show?  Give Tim/Sid a national radio show at noon.  Maybe HC @ Noon becomes a podcast, or keep it on TV and play it on The Fan after PTS.  Or, failing all that – yeah having them replace Blundell would be good too.

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    Sam In Scarb 3 months

    Tim and Sid were horribly miscast to do a 5- 6:30 daily TV show.

    A move back to 590 radio ANYWHERE on the daily lineup would be an instant ratings boost.

    That being said, I am sure they got big $$ to move to TV. Would Robbers be willing to pay them TV money to move back to radio ??

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    Andrew 3 months

    I never understood the move to put them up against Bob from the start, they are definitely not used properly at Sportsnet. I’ll watch their clips from time to time but Sid’s bit is that fake outrage crap just to get a clip to go viral. I’m above that as a sportsfan and I think the viewers are as well. I used to love watching PTI on especially and that was on at 5:30 but as your responsibilities grow with jobs / kids who has time carved out to watch a show between 5-7, the demo that Sportsnet is after is the people with younger families who might not “get” Bob.

    The morning slot would be an improvement over the current people but Sid’s humour might be a little tired for 7am.

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    Hans 3 months

    Would Robbers be willing to pay them TV money to move back to radio ??

    They're already doing that with Damian Cox and his contact since moving him to PTS so it's not something new for them.

    Like others here, I didn't listen to Tim&Sid's podcast. I came into them mostly via PTS when they would sit in during the 4pm hour with Bob and chat away and found them interesting. Check out their afternoon show and enjoyed it for what it was: lightish sports talk with a bunch of silliness. I found Sid could be tolerable for the 3hr block because his stupidity was spread about during the timespan as opposed to how it seems the TV now where the show appears to be built around Sid being a jackass. 

    Personally, I think the TV show of theirs is overproduced, oversanatized and overrated for what it's intended to be. It just doesn't work and sadly I don't think anyone at Sportsnet has thew courage to openly say that out loud – which I don't blame them for given the current environment. At this point, Tim&Sid should be moved back to the radio mornings with their show simulcasted on one of the sportnets', be it 360 or One, as a means to try and make something for the TV side of things.

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    QuintanaRoo 3 months

    First T&S were unlistenable. Then unwatchable. Always unfunny and uninteresting.

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    Brian 3 months

    I rarely watch them on TV but I would listen when to Tim and Sid when were on the radio. Nothing beat them during afternoons. 

    If I were PD at TSN I would make T&S an offer for the Overdrive slot come September 2017 (probably a non-compete in their contracts) on both TV and radio. Give T&S the summer off and let them start fresh.

    I would move the Overdrive guys back to Leafs Lunch for TWO hours each day. Naylor and Simmons/Feschuk/Arthur do two hours in between LL and T&S.

    Then I would bring in Brady and Walker on mornings (shouldn't be crazy expensive given what both are doing now). And have Cauz and Petrillo from 9 till 11 and Scotty Mac on for TSN Jays at 11 until noon during the offseason, 11-1 pm during in-season). LL would be an hour in the summer.

    If this didn't turn TSN around in 18 months to two years, then it can't be fixed.

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    Brandon 3 months

    Interesting read, so a few of my thoughts:

    While I enjoyed the "what if" nature of the writing, it's the kind of thing that if it appeared in a newspaper or magazine, would get utterly destroyed in places like this because it's missing so much.

    How much do Tim and Sid make?

    When is their contract up?

    What would Sportsnet replace them with?

    What is ad revenue like between 5-7 pm?

    What are ratings like, there's so much talk about that and yet, I never see them, so does Sportsnet say they're up because last I heard, they were accomplishing what they wanted and TSN did an about face dumping Landsburg and moving to something different?

    What would they be paid going into mornings?

    Why wouldn't they be a much better fit to replace McCown in afternoons?  I've written it before but you're crazy if you think Rogers wants to put a Jeff Blair or Arash Madani in that chair – there's going to be a lot of scrutiny to replace Bob, maintain the ratings, but also do things differently to attract younger viewers and listeners?  Tim and Sid might be the only ones capable of it, and I wasn't a big fan of them on radio though I drive a lot for my job, I passed over them almost always because of all the bad jokes.

    All these blanks need filling in otherwise it's a real flimsy hypothesis.

    That said, I probably echo most people's comments about the difference between Tim and Sid.  Micallef is a good broadcaster who has to lay awake at night some evenings wondering what he did to get mixed up with Sid, and when can he get free?  

    In my world, Sid and anyone and I'm not listening.  And I haven't been watching on TV either.

    Put Micallef with a Bryan Hayes, you have an excellent sports talk radio show.  I'd listen whenever it was on.

    Put Tim with Elliotte Friedman, same thing.

    Put Micallef with Greg Brady, same thing.

    Now put Sid with any of those three, nope, I'm not into that.

    I don't think that's the move Rogers is even contemplating a year and some into Tim and Sid being on tv.  And if anything, they'd slide to late night and do much better numbers than the Ken Ried Evanka Osmak thing happening that is just insufferable.

    To Brian's post above,

    Yes, TSN should consider each and all of those options.  Overdrive won't work long-term with the lack of knowledge from the two ex-jocks, and there's way too many times in a city like Toronto where the other sports are going to get discussed and they're lost.  An overdrive would work in a Calgary or Winnipeg before it could work in Toronto where you just have to know the history and current status of the Raps and Jays.

    I don't know when Tim and Sid were let go from The Score, but it was pretty smart for The Fan to get them and beat TSN to the punch.  This is why TSN Radio has made many, many mistakes in shows and on-air people that have nothing to do with their signal, or the Fan's shows, or anything.

    Anyway, not being harsh, I enjoyed reading it, but I don't even see any grounds for anything pending or the Tim and Sid speculation other it's practically unanimous on here that the Fan needs a new morning show, and from the way TSM tells it, may be soon getting one./

    I can't be the only one thinking if they're ever to be back on radio, it would be afternoons, and as I said, does Tim want to work with Sid for a 25 or 30 year career?

     

     

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    stephen 3 months

    Agree with Chris, cirroc, Grey county, brandon
     
    I had no problem catching portions of their show when they were 1-4.
    Tim knows his sports and carried the show.
    Sid's faux outrage and rants wore thin, quick. Sid became main reason for me to change stations.  

    "Would Sportsnet ever move Tim & Sid back to radio to take over mornings?"
    Considering who Sportsnet has hired for their morning shows in the past, YES! Only question is, when?

    1) Do you still find Tim&Sid credible sports voices or have they become something else since their move to TV?  Tim: Yes; Sid, no.  Tim's CIS football coverage is solid.

    2) Would you listen to them on your morning commute?  Not a chance.  
     
    3) Do you tune in to watch their TV show or would you be just as happy with Jackie Redmond's clip show on repeat?  By design, I have never seen their show, and I've determined that the only shows worth watching on Sportsnet, are games; and that does not include pre or post games shows.

    Can't imagine Dave Cadeau has much rope left. If his next round of changes don't work, he's probably being promoted – Sportsnet is rich in "Peter Principle" appointments.

  • comment-avatar
    Original Mitch 3 months

    " I rarely stick up for this company" – Sid quote this week. Love it. 

     

     

  • comment-avatar
    Drumanchor 3 months

    Very well said. 

  • comment-avatar
    Patrick 3 months

    Smart column and good comments.

  • comment-avatar

    Honestly I don't know what some of you people want. Bob is too old! Ok. Tim & Sid are too juvenile! Fine. Dave Naylor is too boring! Sure. Bryan Hayes only has his job because his dad and uncle are powerplayers in Toronto radio … It goes on and on. You're never happy. Face it, you just like complaining. Trust me, I have lived in plenty of markets. The talent in Toronto is not any worse than elsewhere. It's just sports. Relax

     

    That having been said …… John Shannon is the worst.

  • comment-avatar
    Pete 3 months

    It intrigues me that when the Tim & Sid move was announced, the thought was that going head-to-head against PTS in the prime time hour was Rogers' way of sabotaging McCown's ratings.  But it seems like the opposite has happened, with McCown's ratings rocking and by all accounts Tim & Sid's show not delivering the ratings expected.  

    There are easons for that.  Most people are in the car after work at 5, not in front of a TV.  For those at home, there is just so much going on (prepping/eating dinner, kids' activities, etc.) to devote two hours to a TV.  Also, I think the lustre of the pair has diminished since making the move to TV (this pretty much pertains to Sid's over-the-top rants and what I perceive as fakeness).  

    I think there are two options for Rogers and Tim & Sid:

    1. Make the logical move and put them in the morning slot.  The current show is a joke, while these guys have been doing great things for a long time now.  I could easily see them nearly doubling the audience that Blundell is currently drawing in.  Main question is…would Tim & Sid agree to a show that requires them to be up at 3 a.m.?  (I know a healthy pay bump would make the decision easier).

    2. Bide their time and have them transition to the PTS time slot if and when McCown retires or departs in the next couple of years.  I imagine them being the succession plan for Bob is at the top of Rogers' list.  Different type of show, but one they would also do a killing in the ratings for the next 25+ years.    

    As for the question if Tim & Sid are tied to each other forever.  I actually think they are.  They've been doing their gig for so long together I believe that going their separate paths would hurt each of their brands and would turn them into a couple of guys who no longer stand out in the market.  They'll still be able to do their side projects, as is the case with Tim and Canadian university football, but on their own?  I don't see it happening.

  • comment-avatar

    Fun discussion so far. 

     

    One thought I had was how doing a radio show could be compatible with doing their current TV clip show. What I am imagining is them doing 1 hour in their current format on TV leaving 2 hours for them to be on radio. One of those hours could be simulcast on TV but it would be a radio show first and a TV show second. 

     

    This could work in the PTS slot: 4-5 on TV only (change the mid-afternoon slot to 2-5), 5-6 on both TV and radio, 6-7 on radio only. Same model could be adjusted for mornings: 6-8 radio only, 8-9 both TV and radio, 9-10 TV only. 

  • comment-avatar
    Original Mitch 3 months

    While I understand their tv ratings aren't very good, we can't totally blame the timeslot as that hour is a very common hour to host sports talk shows. Off the record hovered around that time slot for decades, PTI and around the horn air from 5-6pm. Sportsline was at 5. Moving them to that time slot on tv actually made sense considering the landscape IMO. 

    I believe moving them back to radio would be a glaring acknowledgement of failure. This tv show is national and pumps up all the upcoming action on SN. National commercials everywhere. Lots of promos. Moving them to a local radio station is not a promotion at all. Not saying they shouldn't, but T&S are on a national scale right now. Move them back to the Fan and they go back to being local personalities. 

  • comment-avatar
    yaz 3 months

    I’m with Quintanaroo. And if I ever did try to listen when there was a guest on that I liked – that fing airhorn drove me to TSN.

  • comment-avatar
    Daniel 3 months

    Yeah.  Something like this could be good.  I feel like segments on their show are often pre taped, so you could probably find other times to make it all work as well.

  • comment-avatar
    MjwW 3 months

    I'm sorry, but no one outside of the GTA thinks of Tim & Sid as national personalities. FFS, most of their is Toronto sports focused, how the HELL can you say they are national personalities?

     

    Honestly, it is sickening how many sportsnet employees WASTE their time commenting on here.

  • comment-avatar
    northyorkcanuck 3 months

    Tim & Sid are a cross between the Canadian version of First Take and an unfunny version of Boomer and Carton. Sid's act is especially tiring. He will offer up some smarmy hot take about the awfulness of local team/player — say the Blue Jays — and then pretend to be a died-in-the-wood know-it-all when they become the trendy Toronto team. 

    With that said, IF I were a TIm & Sid fan — if I found the kind of entertainment they do entertaining — I would probably prefer them on the radio. The TV show seems like it's mostly interviews and Sportsnet promo stuff. If I can watch TV at that time, I'd rather be watching SportscentRe than a preview of what's on Sportsnet that night.

    Moreover, they seem to cater to a U-40/U-30ish audience. Those people (with the exception of maybe 18-22) generally aren't watching TV at the time they're on. They're more likely to be in their car. 

  • comment-avatar
    Original Mitch 3 months

    huh?

    Their show is LITERALLY a nationally broadcast show ACROSS the country. it literally cannot be defined as anything BUT a national sports show. If you taught a class in broadcasting school and asked the class to give an example of a SHOW THAT IS BROADCASTED ACROSS CANADA, ERGO A NATIONAL SHOW…T&S would be exhibit A, B and C.

    If you emailed the CRTC and asked for an example of a television program to airs in all 10 provinces you know what show they would give you as an example? that's right, Tim and Sid.

    if you asked a three day old baby to name a show that runs all across Canada making the hosts national personalities by default (obviously duh) you know what show that infant would name?? you guessed it, Tim and Sid!

    Idiot.

     

  • comment-avatar
    Steve 3 months

    T&S is irrelevant at best and most often cringe-worthy and unwatchable.  Their shtick quickly grew tiresome and continues to lack any real creativity, just feeble attempts at hot takes and phony outrage. They haven't evolved whatsoever.  Having said that, Tim has some talent and would likely do just fine if he broke free from his assclown partner. 

  • comment-avatar

    hi everyone, this is your pal mike. Please refrain from calling other commenters idiots and/or implying they work for TSN or SN. A good rule to follow is to attack the point not the person.

     

    Pretty much any TV show on TSN and SN is “national” in the sense that it is available on cable across the country. T&S had this kind of national reach when they were on the Score. They lost that reach when they went to the FAN, and regained it when they went to Sportsnet TV. However it is clear to me that a lot of their content is about and for Toronto, even though the show is available coast to coast. There’s also a question about whether the Raptors and Jays count as “national” topics. So I think you are both right depending on what sense of national you want to use.

     

    On this topic: the most clear cases of “national” sports shows are radio shows that are syndicated. In the U.S. there are several: Jim Rome, Dan Lebatard, Colin Cowherd, Mike & Mike, etc. These can be heard in most markets across the country. Mike & Mike is on 150 different radio stations. We don’t have any syndicated sports radio shows in Canada. The 6pm hour of PTS is on 3 stations outside of Ontario (Calgary, Kelowna, Halifax). Some of TSN’s radio programming is picked up by other TSN radio stations but I can’t think of any that is carried on all 7 of their stations.

  • comment-avatar

    I wrote about coast to coast sports programming in this column

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    Carl A 3 months

    Wholeheartedly agree with your Shannon comment. PTS this week is a waste of time because of it.

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    MontFromLondonOnt 3 months

    Wow- After listening to Cox and some of the other toadies on PTS give me Shannon any day of the week – And a healthy dose of Perkins -I like Shannon and they both entertain me –

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    Island Chris 3 months

    I would be a big fan of the Tim & Sid Morning Show.  When they were on 1-4 I used to listen just to hear them talk, typically I didn't really care to hear too many guests on the air because they always had more fun when it was just the 2 of them.  The TV show on the other hand I only bother paying attention to when they have a guest that I'm interested in.  

    I think radio lends itself much better to having genuine fun.  It's compelling and enjoyable to listen to and much more conversational and real.  TV is just a different animal, and I give the boys credit because they're trying but I always have to remind myself that they aren't still "settling in" to their new show.  It's been on the air for over a year, this is the show.

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    Omar 3 months

    I generally only watch T&S when they are interviewing an interesting guest. Once the interview is over I watch something else. Have no interest in the byplay and banter…comes across as too much shtick.

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    Brad 3 months

    You said it!  I have no time for these two regardless of the time slot or medium.

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    jackbee 3 months

    No need to add anymore to  QuintanaRoo's comment, which is and has always been my opinion of the juvenile antics e,g, noise/siren at every interval of Tim and Sid

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    jackbee 3 months

    agree totally with MjwW as NO ONE outside T.O.or GTA would know or care about Tim anD Sid as broadcasters. Tim has always been strong on CiS no known as U sports announcing gmes over the years, but all his credibility is lost when he stoops to S.S.'s juvenile attempts at humour and/or satire. 

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    jackbee 3 months

    No matter what MIB or other like minded millenials think, Tim and Sid switchover to tv was a DEMOTION and not a PROMOTION.

    in what world does a broadcaster gets LESS hours that previousty on radio, and is considered successful. Couldn't stand T & S on radio and don't watch them on tv. Now their new logo of being serious about sports, is to guffaw at. Like one other poster said, get rid of that annoying horn sound blast and start acting like adult and not high school broadcasters.

    It''s only a matter of time till Rogers says adios to T & S permanently. Put Jackie Redmond and Martine Gaillard, who know their sports and act in professional manner. Betcha their ratings would surpass anything T & S would produce going forward on tv.

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    Sperk 3 months

    To me the faux rage piece has negatively affected T&S's credibility (Question  #1), whether I'd listen in the AM (#2) or whether I'd watch their show over a blooper reel (#3).

    Whenever they go off about something the following thought process goes through my mind "Is this their real opinion or are they trying to get twitter/YouTube likes?"  To me, they have no credibility…not because they aren't knowledgeable but because everything they do is filtered through a "Can Sid say something outrageous about this?" lens.

    Do I need to listen to someone pretending to be angry on my morning commute?  Ah, no 

    Watching NBA guys miss dunks on those blooper reels gives you as much insight on the sport as anything T&S does so it's probably a wash for me.

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    Mike V 3 months

    I don't know what you are talking about. They went from a local radio show in early afternoon to a national TV show during dinner hours. That is most definitely a promotion.

     

     

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    Steve Fournier 3 months

    Thing is, I don't think they could change their act if they wanted to because Sid isn't talented enough to do it any other way.  I think he's too far gone to ever be taken seriously enough to land a gig doing anything else in Toronto sports media.  Not sure anything could wipe that sh*t-eating grin off his face.

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    Hans 3 months

    While I do agree that Jackie Redmond and Martine Gaillard (and many of the other Sportsnet ladies) are a bit underused in their current roles, I don't think they could being thorwn into a prime time slot on TV will make any difference ratings wise. I'd love to see Jackie and/or Martine in the PTS co-host for a few days or a week though. I think that would spice things up for Bob and us listeners given a different view on things from intelligent ladies.

    I also agree with MikeV. It's not a demotion but a promotion since the attitude is still TV > radio so even though Tim&Sid lost an hour it's still more prestige and money for them to be doing 2hours of national TV over 3hrs of local radio.

     

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    following up on the earlier discussion about national broadcasts, TSN PR is touting their World Juniors coverage which will appear on 19 radio stations coast to coast. This strikes me as a good opportunity for them to draw listeners to their 7 all-sports radio stations. That said, I find it totally puzzling that they have not seen any halo effect from having half of the Leafs games on 1050 over the last few years. So maybe these games won't make a difference either.

     

    On Sunday when I watch the NFL on CTV/TSN they throw up a graphic saying the game is brought to you in part by TSN radio but don't actually give out the dial number. I know this is a national broadcast so they can't assume everyone watching is in Toronto, but how hard would it be to add a big graphic advertising TSN1050 with a picture of O'Dog or Landsberg? 

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    jackbee says: No matter what MIB or other like minded millenials think, Tim and Sid switchover to tv was a DEMOTION and not a PROMOTION.

     

    I think we have covered most of the ground on this topic and whether it is a promotion or demotion is in the eye of the beholder. I'll add two things:

     

    1) everyone with whom I have spoken who works in radio is keenly aware of when their show is on TV and gets upset when it is not. You've heard Bob grouse about this on air when his show gets knocked off TV for soccer or whatever. (aside: I have never watched a radio show on TV and have no idea why anyone would when you can stream from your phone instead)

     

    2) This is industry gossip so take it with a grain of salt, but both are rumoured to have received huge raises to go to TV. 

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    One more thought on the T&S TV show. Here's a quote by Scott "9-Lives" Moore from this article back when the show was announced:

     

    "It was a chance for us to reinvigorate that time slot,” Moore says, noting that early evening sportscasts on all sports networks in North America have suffered some “ratings challenges because of the way people consume sports.” Looking south of the border, he says broadcasters have had some success with opinion shows and look-ahead formats.

     

    So the goal of the show was always: 1) to promote the evening content, and 2) to improve on the ratings of whatever was in the 5-7 slot before. This gives some pretty clear metrics for evaluating whether the expenditure for the new contracts, the legion of producers, and the new set were worth it. No one in the industry has been willing to share hard numbers comparing the ratings for 5-7 YOY but I have several sources saying that the T&S ratings are not impressive.

     

    I can't imagine anything in that time-slot being destination viewing which is why I think T&S make more sense on radio and/or as Jay&Dan types on the evening desk (assuming people still watch that kind of show).

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    from the same article, here's another Moore quote and another performance metric:

     

    “Moore says Tim Micallef and Sid Seixeiro’s program, which will debut July 1, is still in development but explains it will have a multiplatform focus and he expects “more people are going to watch on their tablet than other shows.”

     

    Do any of you watch T&S on your tablet on the GO train on your way home?

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    of note on the above 19 radio stations carrying the world juniors: several are Rogers owned, including Sportsnet's FAN960 in Calgary.

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    Pete 3 months

    I know they can fall back on their hefty salaries, but if I'm Tim & Sid and they are viewed as the duo to whose main expectation is to promote the evening's content, I'd be pissed off.  Seems like such a waste.

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    Brandon 3 months

    Some really intelligent comments here, not all but some.  The not-really intelligent ones are obvious.

    Good follow-up info, MIB, but that's exactly why a change is real unlikely.  And certainly not back to radio, the slot is to promote content coming up, have a few guests on, and pray one of Sid's fake opinions goes viral.  That's really it.  They aren't going back to showing highlights, and always have to go up against PTI on TSN, which is the gold standard, still, i think.

    Tim's a lot more critically applauded than Sid, and that's the trend I think things will go.  People have access and sports fans have access to so much information, so the information better be smart.  Beat writers who are lazy on the NHL or MLB beat are being replaced in terms of eyeballs by blogs and podcasts.  The commenter who noted Sid can't do this any other way is absolutely right.  There's smoke, but no fire to all his histrionics.  It's precisely why Blundell has flunked out in mornings and why so many people have just decided to not turn the Fan on until after 9am.  This isn't even a debate.  It's not like there's several people on here going "nah, Blundell's really good.  What a good listen.  You guys just don't get it!" *** No one is doing that.  There are no gimmicks anymore that work.  Mike Richards is full of gimmicks.  No one liked them.  

    I'd point to the Buffalo example of the WGR shows.  Smart guys, no ex-jocks, no fake outrage or manufactured controversy or silly questions like "if Edmonton made McDavid available, what should the Leafs trade?".  I really think that's the way forward, but as for Tim and Sid on tv, they'll be there for quite a while, I believe.  And I'm sure they got big raises given they were on at 1pm and the stations are pretty clear in suggesting lately (Brady, Richards, Tim/Sid departure) that they'd rather not have a big salary there and certainly not with a co-host.

     

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    Brandon 3 months

    Oh, and the most cringeworthy moments of Tim and Sid on TV exist when Sid decides to hit a sound effect.  It's one thing on radio when I can't see you doing it.  When you're pressing a button and looking for reaction, it's utterly awful.  I feel uncomfortable beyond belief and I have so little time for TV at those hours that I'm not subjecting myself to that.  Never midn the air horns.

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    cirroc 3 months

    Off topic, but right up there with Sid's awfulness is Jonas Siegel over on TSN. I honestly can't tell if he's doing schtick or is just the most annoying person on the planet.  O'Dog seems to really have a distaste for him and it makes for awkward radio.  I know it's fun to complain and whatnot but I find myself actually having to turn off Overdrive if Jonas is on.  

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    Original Mitch 3 months

    I think its fair to say that if T@S had any real talent they would have moved south of the border like Dan and Jay as well as a few of those guys at the Score. Or as likely TSN would have picked them up. SN isn’t exactly a hotbed of talented people and those guys fall in that line but with a bit more supposed cool factor.

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    phil 3 months

    loved them in the 1-4 slot. can't watch/listen to them on tv in their current format. seem to be the trend. TSN should grab them for the afternoon.

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    Liberty Village Bob 3 months

        Sportsnet's attempt to create a branded supper hour TV talk show has been a miserable failure. T&S just cycles through inhouse personalities and when they do interviews it's the weakest questions. Don't get me started on how much time they spend promoting the NHL and the Jays. Might as well show Jackie. It's basically the same show as T&S.

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    (Another) Andrew 3 months

    "Don't get me started on how much time they spend promoting the NHL and the Jays."

     

         

     

        …and Harvey's and Swiss Chalet and so on

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    Dan 3 months

    I loved T&S on radio but the move to tv is brutal. I gave them a chance but was very disappointed with what I saw. Sports networks  in this country does not realize that the demographics are changing and we are sick of so much hockey talk especially the ridiculous topics about 3rd line players and players, coaches ect.. from teams people in their own markets does not watch i.e. Phoenix. 

    T&S has become another hockey show to justify the 5 billion sportsnet spent. On radio the show was well balanced with interesting guest and topics but they have completely sold out to the hockey guys. 

    I spend the majority of my time listen to 1270 fox sports and 1520  ESPN and watching PTI. 

    Had high hopes for this show, what a disappointment. 

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    Tim & Sid are doing fine, given the conditions that they’ve been given to work with… Which is being in a position to not succeed. I don’t even know when Tim & Sid is on anymore, it’s apparently around from 5-6 depending on the moon?

    I think the ideal situation now is, when The Legend Bob McCown’s contract runs out & he saunters out into the sunset, Tim & Sid are put into a 4-7 Radio Show On TV Simulcast (Which would be then be whenever SportsNet decides to put them on Air, thanks to Curling or Extra Innings).

    It’s obviously not the old 1-4 FAN 590 program, & far away from the Podcast/Sirius XM Days, but hey—At least SportsNet is giving Tim & Sid the time of the day, even if the Rogers marketing or production has been, whatever.